<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><span></span></div><div><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">I fully agree with the JFC Morfin, and say more like Brazilian, the initiative come from civil society, understand: </span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br></span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">Until a few months ago, Dilma had another position, followed the advice of the Minister of Communications, Paulo Bernardo, that follow the agenda of telecom companies. </span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br></span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">Many activists, including me, and opinion leaders criticized the posture of Paul Bernardo, also we decided to criticize Dilma, since in practice, the adherence to the agenda of telecom companies was the government's position, and not only the ministry.</span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br></span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">Considering the popularity of Rousseff had fallen a lot during the demonstrations in the streets, which were heavily exploited by the opposition to weaken it politically. This new opposition coming from the Internet could be tragic for his project of re-election in 2014.</span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br></span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">After conversation with his predecessor, Lula, Dilma became advised by Franklin Martins, and during this process she met with CGI.Br where she got much of his speech at the UN. This speech that won strong support from the international community, as we know.</span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br></span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">Also we know that ICANN strives to strengthen its multistakeholder model, and thus distance themselves from the image of being an "appendix" of the U.S. government. Realizing the opportunity arose after Rousseff's speech at the UN, Fadi and his counselors come immediately to meet our President to seize this window of opportunity that open.</span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br></span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">And that we have to face, a window of opportunity, we from the civil society have to position ourselves as protagonists behind this "wave", because we know that bad decisions that could change the internet as we know, it may arise, and this time we have to act together and strengthened to rebate.</span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br></span></div><div><span style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">My $0,02</span></div><div style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br></div></div><div style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">-</div><div style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;">João Carlos Caribé</div><div style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><div style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><div>(021) 8761 1967</div><div>(021) 4042 7727</div><div>Skype joaocaribe<br><div>Enviado via iPad</div></div></div></div><div style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><br>Em 13/10/2013, às 08:49, JFC Morfin <<a href="mailto:jefsey@jefsey.com">jefsey@jefsey.com</a>> escreveu:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite" style="-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;"><div>
At 20:52 11/10/2013, Anriette Esterhuysen wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="cite" cite="">Valid point Parminder.Â
<br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="cite" cite="">By then it will be a Brazilian
initiative supported by ICANN, not a Brazilian initiative supported by
ICANN and a considerable part of global civil society... And it wont
change after that...</blockquote></blockquote><br>
Then ?...<br>
<a name="_GoBack"></a><br>
It is an NTIA (or NTIA endorsed/concerted) initiative, presented by ICANN
as a response to Dilma's UN speech, that Dilma could not refuse and,
therefore, everyone must pretend that it is her initiative in line with
her speech. To succeed, Dilma needs us. Not now, when the initiative is
led by US StakeHolders inc. + Telcos (including Brazilians), but rather
when they call on us in response to our first letter.<br><br>
If we support ICANN (NTIA + Brazil Telcos) now, we fail people, the US,
Brazil, and Dilma. The summit must be perceived as coming from (what it
is not) Dilma’s Brazil (Civil Society, OpenUse, Private sector,
international organizations, IGF, UN and OpenStand+ICANN), otherwise it
will be NTIA's coup against the UN (all countries) in coopetition with
the ITU Dubai-signatories (i.e. Russia, China, and possibly Europe[?] as
a liaison), using all of us. I have nothing against the US
"e-colonization" strategy (which is named
"internationalization" in the normative area, e.g. Unicode;
OECD in economy, NATO in military), except that:<br><br>
- I do not think it can bring enough stability to the world digital
ecosystem because it is based on 1983 architectural
statUS-quo that is to protect a market and political statUS-quo.<br>
- I oppose "globalization" being used as a policy.
Globalization is a practical fact that raises problems (economic crisis,
global warming, etc.). The world's uncontrolled globalization is a
pandemic that has to be taken care of.
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globalization#Support_and_criticism.">
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globalization#Support_and_criticism.<br>
</a>- If I was wrong. If the initiative was not sponsored by the NTIA:
who would in this scenario protect the rights of the USG against an IGH
hijacking by ICANN and Brazil? How could the CS rebuild the world only
with those two?<br><br>
Technically, the problem is that the big-data pollution anti-algorithmic
governance shield of this strategy was the NSA. Snowden has shown that
the NSA was no longer technically/professionally reliable. The NSA is a
secret agency that is not able to protect its own secrets. What about
ours?<br><br>
Question: why do we only talk of the US StakeHolders Inc. and Brazil’s
President? <br><br>
What about the Chinese, Russian, European, French, Indian, Tunisian,
Malian, Liechtenstienian, or Palauan (smallest UN member) people’s
positions and societal, industrial, and Telcos’ interests? Why don’t we
discuss the US citizens' democratic feeling on internet globalization?
Why do we never ask around and just discuss the opinions of the happy few
of us? <br><br>
This is most probably because a global democracy can only be
multilateralistic (the UN) or imperialistic and colonialistic (a
dominance). In our area, this means ITU or statUSSH-quo (the status-quo
that benefits the US and all those having a stake in the US private
sector) – actually both as we saw in Dubai and now in Montevideo. We know
that none of them could be sustainable as they would resurrect the cold
war. Actually what we should try to work out is a multicultural,
multilinguistic, multinational, multistakeholder, open and, therefore,
non-communitarian global societal equivalent ideal of the democratic
ideal, i.e. an esthetic for our global and digital time.<br><br>
Such a form of global governance has a name: it is to be called
polycracy. Some of its rules were identified by the WSIS. However, while
we still try to understand the way they work and discover its best
practices, its incompletion and lack of enhanced cooperation (by the
ICANN, RIRs, OpenStand hysteresis) confuse us, pollute everyone’s
thinking, and deny all of us the experience that we need.<br><br>
NB. Hysteresis is the dependence of a system not only on its current
environment (real post-Dubai world) but also on its past environment
(statUS-quo). <br><br>
Let us take enough time for reflection: USSH Inc. states in RFC 6852 that
there is a new modern industrial/normative paradigm. This is the same for
international societal norms, relations, and tools: we have to discuss
and word out the new human and digital rights paradigm and impose them in
the facts (not necessarily through Anonymous exploits, but more
adequately through the digital artifacts that we design, open-code, pay,
and use for and on the net). <br><br>
Politically, Civil Society and the Digital Society (OpenUse) do not have
to consider political strategies, but rather civil and digital rights and
globally constitutional (architectonic) issues. Which world digital
extension do we want? How do we achieve and protect it?<br><br>
A simple test to check if what I am saying is correct: before supporting
ICANN, what did we obtain from ICANN in terms of open-roots globalization
rights as per the Internet technology (and ICANN’s own documents)?
<br><br>
Send Dilma, Fadi, and copy Ban Ki-moon and the world that under the
circumstances we are ready to discuss anything with anyone who would want
to better pursue the WSIS and digital millenium objectives.<br><br>
jfc<br><br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="cite" cite="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="cite" cite="">parminder <br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="cite" cite=""><br>
Anriette<br><br>
On 11/10/2013 19:29, Robert Guerra wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="cite" cite="">Anja +1 <br><br>
We need to be strategic. We also should beware of the consequences of not
engaging in a strategic fashion that takes into consideration
geopolitics. <br><br>
I worry at the level of exuberant enthusiasm felt by many. I fear , as
has happened in the past, CS might be pawns in larger play by far better
resourced actors that ultimately  will result in a very different , more
state-centric model of Internet governance where rights are trampled on.
I hope I'm wrong...<br><br>
regards<br><br>
Robert<br><br>
<br>
--<br>
R. Guerra<br>
Phone/Cell: +1 202-905-2081<br>
Twitter:
<a href="http://twitter.com/netfreedom">twitter.com/netfreedom</a>Â <br>
Email:
<a href="mailto:rguerra@privaterra.org">rguerra@privaterra.org</a><br><br>
On 2013-10-11, at 1:07 PM, Anja Kovacs wrote:<br><br>
<blockquote type="cite" class="cite" cite="">When civil society writes too
many letters to a person in short succession, I am afraid they loose
their force. As I wrote on the Best Bits list, CS letters should be
received with a mix of excitement and apprehension, I am concerned that
when we send a third, more detailed letter to President Rousseff next
week, she will simply receive it with fatigue. <br><br>
Civil society is asking for seats at the table all the time. The point is
what we do when we get there. I think a more detailed letter in ten days
time will have more force. <br><br>
Also because we don't have to sit still in the mean time. There are other
ways in which we can make evident to the Brazilian government thatÂ
we are interested in working with them on this and support this idea,
including by communicating with them to find out more directly and by
seeing whether we can work with them on this through the IGF. <br><br>
My two paise,<br>
Anja<br><br>
<br><br>
<br>
On 11 October 2013 22:04, Norbert Bollow
<<a href="mailto:nb@bollow.ch">nb@bollow.ch</a>> wrote:
<dl>
<dd>Parminder
<<a href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net">
parminder@itforchange.net</a>> wrote:
</dd><dd>> You are just making a general statement that caution and
foresight is
</dd><dd>> good - and with such a statement who can disagree.... But here I
</dd><dd>> havent been told the risk - and beyond  a point, just about any
</dd><dd>> political act carries risk.
</dd><dd>Also, not acting when an opportunity presents itself carries
</dd><dd>more than just the risk of losing that opportunity, it carries the
</dd><dd>certainty of losing that opportunity.
</dd><dd>Greetings,
</dd><dd>Norbert
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The Internet Democracy Project<br><br>
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<pre>--
------------------------------------------------------
anriette esterhuysen
<a href="mailto:anriette@apc.org">anriette@apc.org</a>
executive director, association for progressive communications
<a href="http://www.apc.org">www.apc.org</a>
po box 29755, melville 2109
south africa
tel/fax +27 11 726
1692</pre><font face="Courier New, Courier"></font></blockquote>
</blockquote><br><br>
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<br>
<pre>--
------------------------------------------------------
anriette esterhuysen
<a href="mailto:anriette@apc.org">anriette@apc.org</a>
executive director, association for progressive communications
<a href="http://www.apc.org">www.apc.org</a>
po box 29755, melville 2109
south africa
tel/fax +27 11 726
1692</pre><font face="Courier New, Courier"></font>
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