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<DIV>Ive just looked again at this and it is getting longer and at the same time
worse.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I think it needs a very substantial edit. Any more than two paragraphs and
the chance of it being read is meagre.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>To be honest, I think no more than this is necessary. – the first
paragraph</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Courier New"><FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff"><FONT
size=+0><SPAN class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT
size=+0><FONT style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt">We, the undersigned organizations and
individuals from around the world</FONT></FONT></SPAN><FONT
style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><SPAN class=author-a-z67zjyz85z0bhnz83zz73zbz73zhcui
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT>,
committed to the development of the Internet</FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-np5z81zt7lmz83zz72zz71zpz77zb8z83z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>and its use for advancing social
justice</FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT>,
would like to express our strong support<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-eipz87zz75z1x185yvz83z8z78zz79z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT>f</FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT>o</FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-eipz87zz75z1x185yvz83z8z78zz79z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT>r</FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>the statement delivered this week by
your<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-z80zz69zfz90zz75zjz72zi7z76zz86z6dz70zz88zg
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT>E</FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT>xcellency<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=author-a-eipz87zz75z1x185yvz83z8z78zz79z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT>at
the 68th Session of</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"><FONT
style="FONT-SIZE: 9pt"><FONT><FONT><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>the United Nations General
Assembly.</FONT> </FONT></FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face="Courier New"><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face="Courier New"><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px">(reference
the speech if you wish for those who would like to read more, but dont repeat
it, interpret it, and elaborate on it).</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face="Courier New"><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face="Courier New"><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px">And
specifically I dont think we need to talk post Snowden, and demand apologies
from the USA. That ain’t going to happen.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face="Courier New"><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px"></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" face="Courier New"><SPAN
class=author-a-z74zz67z90z73z0z81zbnz72zz73ztz78zz122zz82zz71z
style="CURSOR: auto; FONT-FAMILY: ; WHITE-SPACE: normal; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; WORD-SPACING: 0px; COLOR: ; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1px; PADDING-TOP: 1px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; LETTER-SPACING: normal; LINE-HEIGHT: 16px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px">Ian
Peter</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
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<DIV><FONT size=3 face=Calibri></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=joana@varonferraz.com
href="mailto:joana@varonferraz.com">Joana Varon</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, September 26, 2013 9:40 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=governance@lists.igcaucus.org
href="mailto:governance@lists.igcaucus.org">governance@lists.igcaucus.org</A> ;
<A title=avri@acm.org href="mailto:avri@acm.org">Avri Doria</A> ; <A
title=bestbits@lists.bestbits.net
href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net">mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> [First draft] Letter to Pres. Rousseff Re: [bestbits]
[governance] Dilma Rousseff's speech at UN</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
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<DIV>
<DIV>Dear Avri et all, <BR><BR></DIV>By now the letter looks like
this:<BR><BR><A href="https://pad.riseup.net/p/IGC-Supports-Brazil"
target=_blank>https://pad.riseup.net/p/IGC-Supports-Brazil</A><BR><BR>Please,
bring your inputs to make it sound more international.<BR><BR></DIV>We haven't
set a time frame to close the drafting and start to collect endorsements, but
there is this opportunity that Carlos Afonso has mentioned to deliver it in
person (Carlos,please, allow me to quote you again within these two
lists):<BR><BR>"It would be *extremely important* to have it <B>ready by <SPAN
tabIndex=0><SPAN>tomorrow</SPAN></SPAN> late night </B>(it can be very late in
the night -- I am not really sleeping these days)<B> Brazilian time</B> so I can
print it and try and deliver it to the Presidenta's hands (or her closest
advisors)." (wrote 7 hours ago).<BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Depending on what you think about this current draft, it might be feasible
to have endorsements by tomorrow night. <BR><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Let's try to close the drafting process tomorrow at 09:00am (Brazilian
time) and have the whole afternoon to collect signatures within
Europe/Asia/Africa and the day to do so within the Americas? <BR><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Sorry for the rush. I'm just trying to follow all the suggestions received
in different threads as coherently as possible. <BR></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>best<BR><BR>joana<BR></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=gmail_extra><BR><BR>
<DIV class=gmail_quote>On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 9:27 PM, Avri Doria <SPAN
dir=ltr><<A href="mailto:avri@acm.org"
target=_blank>avri@acm.org</A>></SPAN> wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote
style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid">Hi,<BR><BR>While
I cannot accept any plan that is dominated by States and their multilateral
closed club, I don't think that the letter necessarily must be read that
way.<BR><BR>She does say:<BR><BR>> 2 - Open, multilateral and democratic
governance, carried out with transparency by stimulating<BR>
<DIV>> collective creativity and the participation of society, Governments
and the private sector.<BR><BR></DIV>And while this is not quite yet an
endorsement of the fully participatory democracy I hope MSism leads to, it
does seem to aim that way.<BR><BR>Yes, is it still top down, as the
governments will be stimulating the people as opposed to the people simulating
the government, but there are other sentiments that do warrant
support.<BR><BR>As long as civil society does not bind itself to government
leadership by buying into a multilateral vision, I suppose it is possible to
come up with something that could get some sort of support.<BR><BR>But in one
day as Carlos asks?<BR><SPAN><FONT color=#888888><BR>avri<BR></FONT></SPAN>
<DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR><BR><BR>On 25 Sep 2013, at 13:04, McTim wrote:<BR><BR>> <cc
list trimmed><BR>><BR>> On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 12:45 PM, michael
gurstein <<A href="mailto:gurstein@gmail.com"
target=_blank>gurstein@gmail.com</A>> wrote:<BR>>> The Brazil
statement is I think, an excellent including the references in<BR>>> the
context of governance to MLism rather than to MSism given the
ambiguity<BR>>> and bad faith which can be ascribed to many of the
particular uses (and<BR>>> users) of the latter
terminology/methodology.<BR>>><BR>>> The multilateral system has
earned its spurs if nothing else through the<BR>>> UNDHR and the work of
such agencies as the WHO and UNICEF and in their times<BR>>> the UNDP
and UNESCO.<BR>>><BR>>> The quite evidently subverted MSism of the
Internet may by my reckoning at<BR>>> this moment be something of a
poisoned challice (if nothing else through the<BR>>> potentially
questionable motives (and ideologies) of its most ardent<BR>>>
governmental and other backers) and we await its redemption through
the<BR>>> (possible) mounting of a suitable response
post-Snowden.<BR>><BR>> MSism needs no "redemption". Just because
one supporter of it got<BR>> caught doing dodgy things does not somehow tar
the entire structure of<BR>> Internet policy making that has been built
over decades.<BR>><BR>> I for one would object quite strongly to the
Caucus supporting MLism<BR>> over MSism. I think it was a fine speech
but if we are going to write<BR>> a letter of support, we should note that
we have always supported<BR>> MSism.<BR>><BR>> If you want a global
treaty to stop governments from spying on<BR>> everything we do online, I
think it foolish to leave it in the hands<BR>> of governments
only!<BR>><BR>> --<BR>> Cheers,<BR>><BR>> McTim<BR>> "A name
indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A<BR>> route
indicates how we get there." Jon Postel<BR>><BR></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>> ____________________________________________________________<BR>>
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clear=all><BR>-- <BR>-- <BR><BR>Joana Varon Ferraz<BR>@joana_varon<BR>PGP
0x016B8E73<BR><BR><BR></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV>
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